حوار يهودى مسيحى حول شخص المسيح ...

[apostle.paul]

no my friend ... my teachers i know them
ma mother one of them cz she know more

your mother when she learned; she learned from jewish books of rabbinical writtings
and i when i talk; i talk from rabbinical writtings

my views abut messiah is very strong n am sure abut dat
jesus is not our messiah i told dat be4

there isn't our and yours messiah
there is one messiah
he came or not
you and your nation isreal rejected jesus as messiah and delivered him to cross
and you not told us why
why u rejected jesus as messiah although all messianic features applied to jesus
you must give me astrong reason for your rejection jesus as messiah

u say jesus is word of g-d >>> i don imagine this ?? how come dat g-d has only 1 word ....haha datz really funny

no my friend
you know that when elohiem create all creature
created it by his word
his word mean his wisdom who is eternal
GOD'S wisdom is being in his essence


messiah is wisdom of GOD
is eternal word of GOD who not separated from GOD'S essence
MEMRA YAHW
and word of GOD is eternal as solomon teach as in proverbs
The LORD brought me forth as the first of his works, before his deeds of old

why he dndnt come from spirit of g-d without any woman !!

;
because the messiah should be son of man
carrying the humanitiy nature to save us from our sins
and moses the prophet teach as in genesis
And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and hers; he will crush your head, and you will strike his heel
the messiah is offspring of woman who strike the devil

my jewish book u talk abut ... do u read ma books be4 ?

no my friend
i read your scrip ture
and defen of it
and believe in yahw the lord of isreal as the only true GOD of all nations and all creature
but i believe also in messiah the image of yahw and his eternal appearnace
the king of kings who save us from true enemies
the devil
and establish the eternal kingdom
who is eternal The high priest in the true the Most Holy Place ;the heaven itself

you must tell me the reasons why u rejected jesus as messiah ​

 

[fredyyy]

:what you have just said tells me
that you dont know anything about the christian faith

It is true

.​

 

[Desert Rose]

but who told u dat i know well abut christians
!!!
am jewish

sorry , I know that you are jewish what am saying is how do you accept to participate in such a debate about Messiah while you dont know the christian faith
is this logical
besides , while you dont know the christian faith pretty well how did you become that sure and certain that Jesus is not Messiah ​

 

[فادي الكلداني]

am here to just learn more arabic
to enhancement n improve my arabic shit language
n every day i gain sum new words >> datz good 4 me
n i hope to make good relation with arabians

this comment struck me the most, it seems that you are not making any value for your eternal life, and everything written here has no account in your mind - learning Arabic and enhance your language can be done through various resources including web-based programs, but here we are discussing some religious facts which can either save your life or perish it.

please consider my words, and think about it.

best,

 

[يهودى]

your mother when she learned; she learned from jewish books of rabbinical writtings
and i when i talk; i talk from rabbinical writtings

there isn't our and yours messiah
there is one messiah
he came or not
you and your nation isreal rejected jesus as messiah and delivered him to cross
and you not told us why
why u rejected jesus as messiah although all messianic features applied to jesus
you must give me astrong reason for your rejection jesus as messiah

no my friend
you know that when elohiem create all creature
created it by his word
his word mean his wisdom who is eternal
GOD'S wisdom is being in his essence


messiah is wisdom of GOD
is eternal word of GOD who not separated from GOD'S essence
MEMRA YAHW
and word of GOD is eternal as solomon teach as in proverbs
The LORD brought me forth as the first of his works, before his deeds of old

;
because the messiah should be son of man
carrying the humanitiy nature to save us from our sins
and moses the prophet teach as in genesis
And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and hers; he will crush your head, and you will strike his heel
the messiah is offspring of woman who strike the devil


no my friend
i read your scrip ture
and defen of it
and believe in yahw the lord of isreal as the only true GOD of all nations and all creature
but i believe also in messiah the image of yahw and his eternal appearnace
the king of kings who save us from true enemies
the devil
and establish the eternal kingdom
who is eternal The high priest in the true the Most Holy Place ;the heaven itself

you must tell me the reasons why u rejected jesus as messiah ​

be4 i begin
i wanna u to know dat
u who begin n be sure dat i will be who end

Matthew 1:23 says that jesus (the messiah) would be called Immanuel, which means "G-d with us." Yet no one, not even his parents, call him Immanuel at any point in the bible.

the messiah must be a physical descendant of David (Romans 1:3 & Acts 2:30). Yet, how could Jesus meet this requirement since his genealogies in Matthew 1 and Luke 3 show he descended from David through Joseph, who was not his natural father because of the Virgin Birth. hence, this prophecy could not have been fulfilled.

Isaiah 7:16 seems to say that before jesus had reached the age of maturity, both of the Jewish countries would be destroyed. Yet there is no mention of this prophecy being fulfilled in the new testament with the coming of jesus, hence this is another messiah prophecy not fulfilled.

wanna more .. tell me

 

[apostle.paul]

in Targum Pseudo-Jonathan. we read:

I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between the offspring of your sons and the offspring of her sons: and it shall be that when the sons of the woman observe the commandments of the Torah, they will direct themselves to smite you on the head, but when they forsake the commandments of the Torah you will direct yourself to bite them on the heel. However, there is a remedy for them but no remedy for you. They are destined to make peace in the end, in the days of the King Messiah.http://www.arabchurch.com/forums/#_ftn1
http://www.arabchurch.com/forums/#_ftnref1Huckel, T. (1998). The Rabbinic Messiah (Ge 3:15). Philadelphia: Hananeel House.

​

the messiah is offsring of woman
​

 

[يهودى]

sorry , I know that you are jewish what am saying is how do you accept to participate in such a debate about Messiah while you dont know the christian faith
is this logical
besides , while you dont know the christian faith pretty well how did you become that sure and certain that Jesus is not Messiah ​

u answered ur self
i wanna to tell u dat i participate here as u all ask me to do dat .. n i told dat be4
i said dat i don know abut christians well but i have christians friends n
we talk abut jesus n messiah .. but wat i meant dat am not strongly know abut christians faith as u all don know strongly abut us
our books tell us dat jesus is not messiah

 

[يهودى]

in Targum Pseudo-Jonathan. we read:

I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between the offspring of your sons and the offspring of her sons: and it shall be that when the sons of the woman observe the commandments of the Torah, they will direct themselves to smite you on the head, but when they forsake the commandments of the Torah you will direct yourself to bite them on the heel. However, there is a remedy for them but no remedy for you. They are destined to make peace in the end, in the days of the King Messiah.http://www.arabchurch.com/forums/#_ftn1
http://www.arabchurch.com/forums/#_ftnref1Huckel, T. (1998). The Rabbinic Messiah (Ge 3:15). Philadelphia: Hananeel House.

​

the messiah is offsring of woman
​

the gospels (especially Matthew 21:4 and John 12:14-15) claim that jesus fulfills the prophecy of Zechariah 9:9

but

(Zechariah 9:10-13) show that the person referred to in this verse is a military king that would rule "from sea to sea". since jesus had neither an army nor a kingdom, he could not have fulfilled this prophecy.

 

[apostle.paul]

Matthew 1:23 says that jesus (the messiah) would be called Immanuel, which means "G-d with us." Yet no one, not even his parents, call him Immanuel at any point in the bible

immanuel is Descrip tive name who mean that el(GOD) with us
as we call messiah the savior
savior is Descrip tive name for messiah as our savior
but his actual name who given by angel to mary jesus(yahwsha)
yahw slave

the messiah must be a physical descendant of David (Romans 1:3 & Acts 2:30). Yet, how could Jesus meet this requirement since his genealogies in Matthew 1 and Luke 3 show he descended from David through Joseph, who was not his natural father because of the Virgin Birth. hence, this prophecy could not have been fulfilled

mary is daughter of david also and from house of david
as the gospel of luke say
He has raised up a horn of salvation for us in the house of his servant David

Isaiah 7:16 seems to say that before jesus had reached the age of maturity, both of the Jewish countries would be destroyed. Yet there is no mention of this prophecy being fulfilled in the new testament with the coming of jesus, hence this is another messiah prophecy not fulfilled

this verse in not messianic prophecy
the messianic prophecy about messiah who will born from virgin
this verse tell us about Maher-Shalal-Hash-Baz​

 

[apostle.paul]

(Zechariah 9:10-13) show that the person referred to in this verse is a military king that would rule "from sea to sea". since jesus had neither an army nor a kingdom, he could not have fulfilled this prophecy

no these verses tell us about peace not wars
read carefully

Rejoice greatly, O Daughter of Zion! Shout, Daughter of Jerusalem! See, your king comes to you, righteous and having salvation, gentle and riding on a donkey, on a colt, the foal of a donkey


our savioe came to zion gentle ridden upon donkey not on horses making peace not wars


I will take away the chariots from Ephraim and the war-horses from Jerusalem, and the battle bow will be broken. He will proclaim peace to the nations. His rule will extend from sea to sea and from the River to the ends of the earth



jesus establish his kingdom with peace not by wars


save us from hell


I will free your prisoners from the waterless pit..
​

 

[يهودى]

immanuel is Descrip tive name who mean that el(GOD) with us
as we call messiah the savior
savior is Descrip tive name for messiah as our savior
but his actual name who given by angel to mary jesus(yahwsha)
yahw slave


mary is daughter of david also and from house of david
as the gospel of luke say
He has raised up a horn of salvation for us in the house of his servant David

this verse in not messianic prophecy
the messianic prophecy about messiah who will born from virgin
this verse tell us about Maher-Shalal-Hash-Baz​

the Messiah will be born of human parents and possess normal physical attributes like other people. He will not be a demi-god, nor will he possess supernatural qualities.

the Messiah must be descended on his father's side from King David (see Genesis 49:10, Isaiah 11:1, Jeremiah 23:5, 33:17; Ezekiel 34:23-24). u claim that jesus was the product of a virgin birth, he had no father ― and thus could not have possibly fulfilled the messianic requirement of being descended on his father's side from King David

 

[apostle.paul]

the Messiah will be born of human parents and possess normal physical attributes like other people. He will not be a demi-god, nor will he possess supernatural qualities

i proved that the messiah'name is el gabbor as isaiah call him in his prophecy
el gabbor which mean the mighty GOD


AND THE KING DAVID CALL HIM ELOHIEM IN THE PSLAM 45

AND YOU NOT REPLY ON ME
and in isalah prophecy ha said
Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will be with child and will give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel

u claim that jesus was the product of a virgin birth, he had no father ― and thus could not have possibly fulfilled the messianic requirement of being descended on his father's side from King David

there isn't any verse in your scri pture say that messiah must have father from david decsenants
all verses declare that messiah is son of david only
and mary is from house of david and her son is hereditary son of her house.....house of king david
​

 

[يهودى]

Micah 5:2
"But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting."

the gospel of matthew (Matthew 2:5-6) claims that jesus’ birth in Bethlehem fulfils this prophecy

"Bethlehem Ephratah" in Micah 5:2 refers not to a town, but to a clan: the clan of Bethlehem, who was the son of Caleb’s second wife, Ephrathah (1 Chronicles 2:18, 2:50-52 & 4:4).

the prophecy (if that is what it is) does not refer to the Messiah, but rather to a military leader, as can be seen from Micah 5:6. This leader is supposed to defeat the Assyrians, which, of course, jesus never did. It should also be noted that Matthew altered the text of Micah 5:2 by saying: "And thou Bethlehem, in the land of Judah" rather than "Bethlehem Ephratah" as is said in Micah 5:2. He did this, intentionally no doubt, to make this verse appear to refer to the town of Bethlehem rather than the family clan.

u still think that jesus = messiah ?????

 

[يهودى]

The Messiah brings about an end to all forms of idolatry
(Zechariah 13:2)
The Messiah leads the world to become vegetarian
(Isaiah 11:6-9)
Eventually the dead will be resurrected
(Isaiah 26:19; Daniel 12:2; Ezekiel 37:12-13; Isaiah 43:5-6)
The nations of the earth will recognize that they have been wrong, that the Jews have been right, and that the sins of the Gentile nations, their persecutions and the murders they committed, have been borne by the Jewish people
(Isaiah 53)
All weapons will be destroyed
(Ezekiel 39:9,12)


where are u jesus to do all this ???!!!!!!!!!!

 

[apostle.paul]

Bethlehem Ephratah" in Micah 5:2 refers not to a town, but to a clan: the clan of Bethlehem, who was the son of Caleb’s second wife, Ephrathah (1 Chronicles 2:18, 2:50-52 & 4:4

Bethlehem Ephratah is the town of david where jesus born
from your scri pture
Bethlehem was a minor town, not one held by a large and powerful clan, but it was the birthplace of King David (1 Sam 16:1; 17:12) and will also be the birthplace of the Messiah, Jesus Christ (Matt 2:3–6; Luke 2:4–7). http://www.arabchurch.com/forums/#_ftn1 http://www.arabchurch.com/forums/#_ftnref1Adeyemo, T. (2006). Africa Bible commentary (1080). Nairobi, Kenya; Grand Rapids, MI.: WordAlive Publishers; Zondervan.



​

 

[apostle.paul]

The Messiah leads the world to become vegetarian
(Isaiah 11:6-9)

these not present in isaiah
isaiah say

The wolf will live with the lamb, the leopard will lie down with the goat, the calf and the lion and the yearling together; and a little child will lead them


isaiah is obvious
messiah will gether isreal and nations in his kingdom


in targum to jonathan of prophets we read

And a king shall come forth from the sons of Jesse, and the Messiah shall be anointed from among his children’s children. And upon him shall rest the spirit of divine prophecy, the spirit of wisdom and sagacity, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and fear of the Lord. And the lord shall bring him near to the worship of Him. He shall not judge according to the sight of his eyes, not shall he reprove according to the hearing of ears. But he shall judge the poor in truth, and shall reprove in faithfulness for the needy of the people. He shall smite the guilty of the land with the word of his mouth, and with the speech of his lips he shall slay Armilus the wicked. The righteous shall surround him, and the faithful shall be near him. In the days of Israel’s Messiah, peace shall abound in the land; the wolf shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid, and the calf and the lion and the fatling together, and a small suckling child leading them. And the cow and the bear shall graze, their young ones shall lie down together, and the lion shall eat straw like the ox. The suckling child shall play laughingly over the hole of the winding serpent, and the weaned child shall put his hands over the eyeballs of the venomous snake. They shall do no harm nor destroy on all My holy mountain, for the land shall become full of the knowledge of the worship of the Lord, as the waters cover the sea. And it shall be at that time that kings shall obey the descendant of Jesse, who is destined to stand as a sign to the nations, and the place of his dwelling shall be glorious. At that time the Lord shall again show His might a second time, to deliver the remnant of His people who are left, from Assyria, form Egypt, from Pathros, from India, from Elam, from Babylon, from Hamath, and from the islands of the sea. And He shall raise a sign to the nations, and shall gather together the scattered of Israel, and shall bring back the Dispersion of Judah from the four directions of the earth. The jealousy of the tribe of Ephraim shall vanish, and they who oppress the tribe of Judah shall be destroyed. They of the tribe of Ephraim shall not be jealous of the tribe of Judah, and they of the tribe of Judah shall not oppress the tribe of Ephraim. But they shall put their shoulders together to smite the Philistines who are in the west; together they shall despoil the people of the east; they shall put forth their hand against Edom and Moab, and the Ammonites shall become subservient to them. And the Lord shall dry up the tongue of the sea of Egypt, and He shall raise the striking power of his might over the Euphrates by the word of His prophets, and He shall smite it into seven brooks which they can cross dryshod. And there shall be a paved road for the remnant of His people who are left from the Assyrian, just as there was for Israel on the day of their going up from the land of Egypt.http://www.arabchurch.com/forums/#_ftn1
http://www.arabchurch.com/forums/#_ftnref1Huckel, T. (1998). The Rabbinic Messiah (Is 11:6). Philadelphia: Hananeel House.

​

.
​

 

[يهودى]

i proved that the messiah'name is el gabbor as isaiah call him in his prophecy
el gabbor which mean the mighty GOD


AND THE KING DAVID CALL HIM ELOHIEM IN THE PSLAM 45

AND YOU NOT REPLY ON ME
and in isalah prophecy ha said
Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will be with child and will give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel
there isn't any verse in your scri pture say that messiah must have father from david decsenants
all verses declare that messiah is son of david only
and mary is from house of david and her son is hereditary son of her house.....house of king david
​

The Messiah traces his lineage only through King Solomon (II Samuel 7:12-17; I Chronicles 22:9-10). But according to Luke 3:31, jesus was a descendant of Nathan, another son of King David, and not a descendant of King David through King Solomon.

The Messiah cannot trace his lineage through Jehoiakim, Jeconiah, or Shealtiel, because this royal line was cursed (I Chronicles 3:15-17; Jeremiah 22:18,30). But according to both Matthew 1:11-12 and Luke 3:27, Jesus was a descendant of Shealtiel.

 

[apostle.paul]

The Messiah traces his lineage only through King Solomon (II Samuel 7:12-17; I Chronicles 22:9-10). But according to Luke 3:31, jesus was a descendant of Nathan, another son of King David, and not a descendant of King David through King Solomon

GOD promised david as in psalm
The LORD swore an oath to David with a promise he will never take back: "I will place one of your descendants on your throne.
messiah will be from descendants of king david
and not determine which son of david

and about the verse in 1 chronicles
its about messiah not solomon
st.paul say in the epistle to hebrew
For to which of the angels did God ever say, "You are my Son; today I have become your Father"? Or again, "I will be his Father, and he will be my Son"?

​

 

[يهودى]

Just question for you man

In Mark 8:35 jesus said: "...but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel’s the same shall save it."

How could Jesus have said this when there was no gospel when he lived?

The gospel did not appear until after his death.

 

[فادي الكلداني]

Just question for you man

In Mark 8:35 jesus said: "...but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel’s the same shall save it."

How could Jesus have said this when there was no gospel when he lived?

The gospel did not appear until after his death.

I'm not sure why you use the Islamic style of the questions without reading commentaries regarding each verse or word you read from the gospel...

Gospel Means the Good News - and it doesn't mean a written book - do any simple search in google about this certain word, and you will see multiple explainations to what it means