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الرسالة: [QUOTE="NEW_MAN, post: 1855027, member: 990"] [LEFT][URL="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/9925"][SIZE=4]http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/9925[/SIZE][/URL][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080][B]1 TIMOTHY 3:16 - REVIEW OF EVIDENCES - INTRODUCTION[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Understandably the following is truly a battleground verse, [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]especially vis a vis the Deity of Messiah,[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]and needs a little discussion of its authority :-)[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800080]1 Tim 3:16 (KJB)[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800080]And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: [/COLOR][/SIZE] [COLOR=#800080][SIZE=4][B]God was manifest in the flesh[/B], [/SIZE][/COLOR] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800080]justified in the Spirit, [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800080]seen of angels, [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800080]preached unto the Gentiles, [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800080]believed on in the world, [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800080]received up into[/COLOR] [COLOR=#800080]glory. [/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Note that if you get taken in by modern version "textcrit" and its reliance on two ultra-corrupt manu******s, then you will always fight the Word of God. [/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]We addressed the evidence last in 2002 [/COLOR][COLOR=#000080][URL="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/3947"][COLOR=#247cd4]http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/3947[/COLOR][/URL][/COLOR][/SIZE] [COLOR=#000080][SIZE=4]We will we-address it some, with some new material, especially on the early church writers.[/SIZE][/COLOR][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080][B]INTERNAL EVIDENCE IS STRONGLY FOR "THEOS "[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Grammatially the very lightly attested alternatives simply don't work, as the few manu******s generally have "who" or "which" instead of God, which is a grammatical abomination, lacking a subject. [/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Also the manu****** evidence is overwhelming, here I will give a summary[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080][B]GREEK MANUSCIPT EVIDENCE IS OVERWHELMING FOR "THEOS"[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]1 Tim 3:16 GREEK MANU******S EVIDENCE. [/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]============================================================[/COLOR][/SIZE] [COLOR=#000080][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080][B]EARLY CHURCH WRITER CITATIONS - [/B][/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR] [COLOR=#000080][B][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]APPROX 20 HAVE "God was manifest...."[/COLOR][/SIZE][/B][/COLOR][COLOR=#000080][/COLOR][/LEFT][COLOR=#000080] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]The following are early church writers who support the "God is manifest in the flesh".[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]The first group of three are 100-200 years before the earliest manu******s. [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]These are especially significant as the nonsense claim against the verse is that it was somehow inserted late, and then somehow took over the diverse manu****** line.[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]======================================================================[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080][B]BEFORE 300 AD. [/B][/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][B][FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#008080]Ignatius (100 AD)[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][/B] [SIZE=4][FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR=#800000]This is from the[/COLOR][/FONT][COLOR=#000000] Roberts-Donaldson English Translation [/COLOR][/SIZE] [FONT=Trebuchet MS][URL="http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/ignatius-ephesians-roberts.html"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/ignatius-ephesians-roberts.html[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][/FONT][URL="http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/ignatius-ephesians-roberts.html"] [/URL][FONT=Trebuchet MS][URL="http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/ignatius-magnesians-roberts.html"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/ignatius-magnesians-roberts.html[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][/FONT][URL="http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/ignatius-magnesians-roberts.html"][/URL][/LEFT][URL="http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/ignatius-magnesians-roberts.html"] [LEFT][/LEFT][/URL][LEFT][SIZE=4][FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR=#800000]There is one Physician who is possessed both of flesh and spirit; both made and not made; [B]God [/B][/COLOR][/FONT][B][COLOR=#008000](Theos) [/COLOR][FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR=#800000]existing in flesh [/COLOR][/FONT][COLOR=#008000](sarki)[/COLOR][FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR=#008000];[/COLOR][/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR=#800000] true life in death; both of Mary and of God; first possible and then impossible, even Jesus Christ our Lord.",[/COLOR][/FONT][/B][FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR=#000000][B]Ephesians 7:2[/B][/COLOR][/FONT][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR=#800000]Hence every kind of magic was destroyed, and every bond of wickedness disappeared; ignorance was removed, and the old kingdom abolished, [B]God Himself being manifested [/B][/COLOR][/FONT][B][FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR=#008000]([/COLOR][/FONT][COLOR=#000000]phanerosas) [/COLOR][FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR=#800000]in human form[/COLOR][/FONT][/B][FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR=#800000] for the renewal of eternal life. And now that took a beginning which had been prepared by God. [/COLOR][/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR=#000000][B]Ephesians 19:3[/B][/COLOR][/FONT][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]Longer, (probably not Ignatius), form of this epistle has [/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]“God being manifested as a man” ([I]theou anthropinos phaneroumenou[/I]).[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR=#800000][URL="http://individual.utoronto.ca/jskira/syllabus-0-843-02.html"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://individual.utoronto.ca/jskira/syllabus-0-843-02.html[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][/COLOR][/FONT] [SIZE=4][FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR=#800000]On this account also they were persecuted, being inspired by His grace to fully convince the unbelieving that there is [B]one God, who has manifested Himself by Jesus Christ His Son[/B], who is His eternal Word, not proceeding forth from silence, and who in all things pleased Him that sent Him. [/COLOR][/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS][B][COLOR=#000000]Magnesians 8:a[/COLOR][/B][/FONT][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][B][FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]IGNATIUS SUMMARY[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][/B] [FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]Reasonable sense of allusion to 1 Timothy 3:16,[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]combined over three complimentary verses, with vocabulary matching.[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][/LEFT] [LEFT][FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]===========================================================================================[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#008080][B]Hippolytus (170-236 AD)[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][/LEFT] [LEFT][B][FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR=#800000][SIZE=4]Psalm 2 - [/SIZE][URL="http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/hippolytus-exegetical.html"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/hippolytus-exegetical.html[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][/COLOR][/FONT][/B][URL="http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/hippolytus-exegetical.html"] [/URL][COLOR=#800000][FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4]On Psalm II [/SIZE][/FONT][/COLOR] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]When he came into the world, [B]He was manifested as God and man[/B]. [/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR=#800000][B][SIZE=4]Noetus - [/SIZE][URL="http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/hippolytus-dogmatical.html"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/hippolytus-dogmatical.html[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][/B][/COLOR][/FONT][URL="http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/hippolytus-dogmatical.html"] [/URL][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]Against [/COLOR][FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR=#800000]Noetus 17:5[/COLOR][/FONT][/SIZE] [FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]"He now, coming forth into the world, [B]was manifested as God in a body.[/B]" [/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][/LEFT] [LEFT][FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR=#800000][B][SIZE=4]Appendix - [/SIZE][URL="http://www.ccel.org/fathers2/ANF-05/anf05-20.htm"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.ccel.org/fathers2/ANF-05/anf05-20.htm[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][/B][/COLOR][/FONT][URL="http://www.ccel.org/fathers2/ANF-05/anf05-20.htm"] [/URL][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]Appendix 1[/COLOR][/SIZE] [FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]"Thus, too, they preached of the advent of [B]God in the flesh to the world.[/B]" [/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][/LEFT] [LEFT][FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]Appendix 22[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]For our [B]God sojourned with us in the flesh.[/B]"[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][/LEFT] [LEFT][FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000][B]HIPPOLYTUS SUMMARY[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]Four verses that strongly reflect "God was manifest in the flesh"[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000000]==========================================================================[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#008080][B]Dionysius of Alexandria - (264 AD)[/B][/COLOR][COLOR=#000080], also called Pseudo-Dionysius[/COLOR][/SIZE] [FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]"For [B]God was manifest in the flesh,[/B] made of woman, [/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]born out of God the Father, out of the womb before the morning star." [/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [B][SIZE=4][COLOR=#008000]Sacrosancta concilia[/COLOR][/SIZE][/B] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]"It has been alleged that the letter to Paul of Samosata was not actually the work of Dionysius,[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]but it cannot be denied that it belongs to the 3rd century and has "God". - Terence Brown[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]==========================================================================[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Now here are the mass of ECW references from the early years, [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080][B]generally before or around the same time as the earliest manu******s.[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]=================================================================[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080][B]1 Timothy 3:16 "THEOS" 300-525 AD [/B][/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][B][SIZE=4][COLOR=#008000]SUMMARY[/COLOR][/SIZE][/B][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Apostolic Constitutions 4th century (represents earlier tradition)[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Gregory Thaumaturgus; 4th Century: [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Chrysostom (380 AD), [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Didymus (325 AD), [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Diodorus of Taurus (370 AD), [/COLOR][COLOR=#000080]quotes Paul's actual words asserts them in Paul's epistle to Timothy. [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Gregory of Nazianzus (355 AD), [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Gregory of Nyssa (370 AD). (over 20 references) [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Chrysostom (died [/COLOR][COLOR=#000080]A[/COLOR][COLOR=#000080].[/COLOR][COLOR=#000080]D[/COLOR][COLOR=#000080]. 407) has at least three references to God manifest in the flesh,[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Cyril of Alexandria (410 AD),[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Theodoret (420 AD) [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Euthalius (458 AD) fifth-century writer chapter title of I Tim. 3, attesting to "God in the flesh."[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Anonymous -- citation in works of Athanasius (430 AD), [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Macedonius 11(496 AD),[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Severus, (6th century)[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Bishop of Antioch (512 AD)[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080](many more later)[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]======================================================================[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#008000][B]DETAIL - WIP for Web page [/B][/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][B][COLOR=#008080]Apostolic Constintustions - (4th century, earlier tradition)[/COLOR][/B][COLOR=#000080],[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4][URL]http://www.piney.com/DocAposConstitu2.html[/URL][/COLOR][/SIZE][URL="http://www.piney.com/DocAposConstitu2.html"] [/URL][COLOR=#800000][URL="http://www.catholicfirst.com/thefaith/churchfathers/volume07/apostolic09.cfm"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.catholicfirst.com/thefaith/churchfathers/volume07/apostolic09.cfm[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][/COLOR][URL="http://www.catholicfirst.com/thefaith/churchfathers/volume07/apostolic09.cfm"] [/URL][COLOR=#800000][SIZE=4]Thou, O God, who art powerful, faithful, and true, and without deceit in thy promises; who didst send upon earth Jesus thy Christ to live with men, as a man, when he was God the Word, and man, to take away error by the roots: . . . “Hosanna to the Son of David. Blessed be he that cometh in the name of the Lord” [B]God the Lord, who was manifested to us in the flesh.[/B][/SIZE][/COLOR] [B][SIZE=4][COLOR=#008000]Apostolical Constitutions. Book 7.Section XXVI [/COLOR][/SIZE][/B][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][B][COLOR=#008080]Athanasiaus - (c. 350 AD)[/COLOR][/B][COLOR=#000080],[/COLOR][/SIZE] [FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]"And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness, [B]God was manifest in the flesh.[/B]" [/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#008000][B]Ephesians 14[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][/LEFT] [LEFT][B][SIZE=4][COLOR=#008080]Gregory of Nazianus - (c. 355 AD)[/COLOR][/SIZE][/B] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4][URL]http://www.levendwater.org/analysis/a3/mystery_manifested.htm[/URL][/COLOR][/SIZE][URL="http://www.levendwater.org/analysis/a3/mystery_manifested.htm"] [/URL][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Gregory of .. Nazianzus (quoted Theos) in two places (Burgon)[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#008080][B]Diodorus of Tarsus - (c. 360 AD)[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE] [COLOR=#000080][URL="http://www.wayoflife.org/articles/truefalse/truefalse03.htm"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.wayoflife.org/articles/truefalse/truefalse03.htm[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][SIZE=4] - [/SIZE][/COLOR][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]Terence H. Brown [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]Diodorus of Tarsus (died A.D. 370) quotes Paul's actual words and asserts that he [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]finds them in Paul's epistle to Timothy. [/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#008080][B]Gregory Nyssa - (c. 380 AD)[/B][/COLOR][COLOR=#000080],[/COLOR][/SIZE] [FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]"He, I say, appeared on earth and conversed with men ... that we might be convinced that [B]God was manifested in the flesh,[/B] and believe that to be the only true mystery of godliness, which was delivered to us by the very Word and God."[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [B][SIZE=4][COLOR=#008000]Against Apollinarius [/COLOR][/SIZE][/B][/LEFT] [LEFT][FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]"And hence it is that all who preach the word point out the wonderful character of the mystery in this respect, that [B]God was manifested in the flesh.[/B]"[B] Gregory Nyssa (331-395 AD),[/B] [/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#008000][B]Against Apollinarius [/B][/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][COLOR=#800000][SIZE=4].....the Gospel proclaims "the Word became flesh" [Jn 1.14] and the Spirit descended in the form of a dove [Mt 3.16]. Nothing is said here of the Spirit becoming incarnate with regard to the mystery of our faith. "His glory has dwelt in our land" [Ps 84.10]. "Truth has sprung from the earth" [Ps 84.12]. [B]"God has manifested himself in flesh" [1Tm 3.126]. [/B][/SIZE][/COLOR] [B][SIZE=4][COLOR=#008000]Against Apollinarius [/COLOR][COLOR=#008000][J.147][/COLOR][/SIZE][/B][/LEFT] [LEFT][COLOR=#800000][SIZE=4]our Lord's dispensation for mankind [B]when God manifested himself in the flesh, [/B][/SIZE][/COLOR] [B][SIZE=4][COLOR=#008000]Against Apollinarius [/COLOR][COLOR=#008000][J.135][/COLOR][/SIZE][/B][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]"[B]Gregory of Nyssa frequently and powerfully testified for "God manifest in the flesh"[/B] ....Gregory died in A.D. 394 and his life spanned the period during which the 4th century Codex Sinaiticus was written. In those of his writings that have survived he has [B]"God" in this text no less than twenty-two times.[/B] - Terence H. Brown [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]Some references from - [/COLOR][COLOR=#800000][URL="http://www.bhsu.edu/artssciences/asfaculty/dsalomon/nyssa/appolin.html"][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.bhsu.edu/artssciences/asfaculty/dsalomon/nyssa/appolin.html[/COLOR][/URL][/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#008080][B]Chrysotom - (c. 400 AD)[/B][/COLOR][COLOR=#000080],[/COLOR][/SIZE] [FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]"And wonder not that Paul saith in another place, [B]God was manifested in the flesh[/B] [/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]... after saying, was manifested in the flesh, he adds, was [B]seen of angels.[/B]"[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#008000][B]John, Homily 15.[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][/LEFT] [LEFT][FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR=#800000][SIZE=4]"Since in his directions to the Priests he had required nothing like what is found in Leviticus he refers the whole matter to Another, saying, [B]God was manifest in the flesh.[/B] The Creator was seen incarnate. He was [B]justified in the Spirit." [/B][/SIZE][/COLOR][/FONT] [B][FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#008000]1st Timothy, Homily 2[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][/B][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR=#800000]"[/COLOR][/FONT][COLOR=#800000]Chrysostom (died A.D. 407) has at least three references to God manifest in the flesh" [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]Terence H. Brown [/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#008080][B]Augustine - (c. 410 AD)[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE] [FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]"In using this blasphemous language, he probably referred to the representations of Jesus as [B]God manifest in the flesh,[/B] which he regarded as Jewish and abominable."[B] Augustine (354-430 AD),[/B] Against the Manichaeans, Chapter 3[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][/LEFT] [LEFT][FONT=Trebuchet MS][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]"It is [B]God manifest in the flesh[/B] that meets all the conditions for the solution of the problem of human existence."[B] Augustine (354-430 AD),[/B] Against the Manichaeans, Chapter 8[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#008080][B]Cyril of Alexander - (c. 410 AD)[/B][/COLOR][COLOR=#000080],[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4][URL]http://www.wayoflife.org/articles/truefalse/truefalse03.htm[/URL][/COLOR][/SIZE][URL="http://www.wayoflife.org/articles/truefalse/truefalse03.htm"] [/URL][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]Cyril of Alexandria who wrote "God manifest..." in two places, while in another he wrote, "Ye do err, not knowing the ******ures, nor indeed the great mystery of Godliness, that is Christ, who was manifested in the flesh". Elsewhere he wrote, "I consider the mystery of Godliness to be no other but the Word of God the Father, who Himself was manifested in the flesh". These uses of "who" cannot be quoted against the presence of "God" in the manu******s in Cyril's hands. [/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#008080][B]Euthalius - (c. 450 AD)[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4][URL]http://www.wayoflife.org/articles/truefalse/truefalse03.htm[/URL][/COLOR][/SIZE][URL="http://www.wayoflife.org/articles/truefalse/truefalse03.htm"] [/URL][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]Euthalius in the 5th century attributed to a "wise and pious Father" the section title for 1 Timothy 3:16-4:7. This title makes mention of "God incarnate" and was used by Gregory of Nyssa in his dispute with Apollinaris in the 4th century. [/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#008080][B]Anonymous - (c 430 AD)[/B][/COLOR][B][COLOR=#008080] citation in works of Athanasius[/COLOR][/B][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]Among 5th century witnesses was a writer formerly confused with Athanasius. At the time of the Nestorian controversy this now anonymous writer [B]insisted that the correct reading was "God"[/B]. This writer would have settled the great debate about the testimony of the Codex Alexandrinus in favour of "God". The anonymity of the writer does not weaken the force of his testimony. - Terence Brown[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]================================================================= [/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#008000][B]GENERAL SUGGESTION[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Dean John Burgon demonstrated the overwhelming evidence for the Byzantine/Majority reading of the[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]verse over 100 years ago. There has never been a refutation. [/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Anybody on this forum who attacks 1 Timothy 3:16[/COLOR][/SIZE] [COLOR=#800080][SIZE=4][B]God was manifest in the flesh[/B], [/SIZE][/COLOR] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080][B]should be ready to actually deal with the actual evidences, [/B][/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]and not just quote a 'textcrit scholar' like Bruce Metzgar or Bart Ehrman. [/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]If you need help understanding why [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]a) the paradigms of modern textcrit are way off,[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]b) how the "modern versions" of the Bible of the Month Club are grossly defective,[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]c) and how it came about that they rely principally on two grossly corrupt manu******s.[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]We will be happy to assist you :-)[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]==================================================================[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080][B]URL BIBLIOGRAPHY[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][COLOR=#800000][URL="http://www.patriotist.com/wkarch/wk20030707.htm"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.patriotist.com/wkarch/wk20030707.htm[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][/COLOR][URL="http://www.patriotist.com/wkarch/wk20030707.htm"] [/URL][COLOR=#800000][SIZE=4]1 Timothy 3:16 - GOD was Manifest in the Flesh - Will Kinney[/SIZE][/COLOR][/LEFT] [LEFT][URL="http://members.aol.com/DrTHolland/Chapter3.html"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://members.aol.com/DrTHolland/Chapter3.html[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][URL="http://members.aol.com/DrTHolland/Chapter3.html"] [/URL][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]Thomas Holland [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]A textual variant of great importance is found in 1 Timothy 3:16. The King James Version reads, "God was manifest in the flesh." Most contemporary versions, using the Alexandrian Text, read, "He was manifest in the flesh." There is an obvious difference between [I]He[/I] and [I]God[/I]. The KJV makes a clear proclamation concerning the deity of Jesus Christ. Ignatius apparently used a text that reflected the reading found in the KJV. He writes, "There is one Physician who is possessed both of flesh and spirit; both made and not made; God existing in flesh" ([I]Ephesians[/I] 7:1) and "God Himself being manifested in human form" ([I]Ephesians[/I] 19:1). Ignatius uses the Greek words for [I]God[/I] ([I]theos[/I]) and for [I]flesh[/I] ([I]sarki[/I]) in the first citation, and a form of the Greek word for [I]manifest[/I] ([I]peanerosas[/I]) in the second. This would agree with the Greek found in the Traditional Text. [/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]Information, other language versions, Westcott Hort historical[/COLOR][/SIZE] [COLOR=#800000][URL="http://www.wayoflife.org/articles/truefalse/truefalse03.htm"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.wayoflife.org/articles/truefalse/truefalse03.htm[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][/COLOR][URL="http://www.wayoflife.org/articles/truefalse/truefalse03.htm"] [/URL][COLOR=#800000][SIZE=4]TRUE OR FALSE? - Edited by David Otis Fuller [/SIZE][/COLOR] [COLOR=#800000][SIZE=4]GOD WAS MANIFEST IN THE FLESH (1 Timothy 3:16) - By Terence H. Brown [/SIZE][/COLOR] [COLOR=#800000][SIZE=4]THE WEAKNESS OF THE ARGUMENT FROM SILENCE [/SIZE][/COLOR] [COLOR=#800000][SIZE=4]Westcott and Hort and other modern scholars have argued that if the correct reading had been "God manifest..." Origen and Eusebius would have quoted it. Nothing can be proved in this way.[/SIZE][/COLOR][/LEFT] [LEFT][COLOR=#800000][URL="http://www.studytoanswer.net/bibleversions/gnostic.html#itim316"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.studytoanswer.net/bibleversions/gnostic.html#itim316[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][URL="http://www.studytoanswer.net/bibleversions/gnostic.html#itim316"] [/URL][SIZE=4]Gnostic Corruptions in the Critical Texts[/SIZE] [/COLOR][SIZE=4][FONT=trebuchet ms][COLOR=#800000]A Case Study On the Nestle-Aland Greek New Testament, 21st Edition[/COLOR][/FONT][COLOR=#000000] - [/COLOR][FONT=trebuchet ms][COLOR=#800000]Timothy W. Dunkin.[/COLOR][/FONT][/SIZE] [FONT=trebuchet ms][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]This alteration seems pretty straightforward. By changing "God" to the more general "he", the potentially offensive (to Gnostics) idea that the Demiurge would be incarnated into the world and "justified in the Spirit", "received up into glory", etc. is diverted. Thus, the alteration avoids casting the Demiurge into the role which should be fulfilled by the heavenly alien Saviour. On the other hand, if one wishes to consider "God" in this passage (from a Gnostic point of view) as referring to the Eternal Father, then this change is equally supportive of Gnostic theology. The truth of the voluntary incarnation of the eternal God into His own creation is weakened, and replaced with language which could still support the entry of [B]Jesus Christ[/B], as a created aeon, into the material world.[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=trebuchet ms][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]Support for the Textus Receptus Reading[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=trebuchet ms][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]4th c. (poss. 7th c.) corrector of Codex Sinaiticus[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=trebuchet ms][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]5th c. corrector of Codex Alexandrinus[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=trebuchet ms][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]6th c. corrector of Ephraemi Re******us[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=trebuchet ms][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]9th c. copy of Codex Bezae Cantabrigiensis [D][/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000000]----[/COLOR][/SIZE] [FONT=trebuchet ms][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]The large majority of the Byzantine text set[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=trebuchet ms][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]The large majority of the Greek lectionaries[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][/LEFT] [LEFT][URL="http://members.aol.com/kjvisbest/1tim316.htm"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://members.aol.com/kjvisbest/1tim316.htm[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][URL="http://members.aol.com/kjvisbest/1tim316.htm"] [/URL][URL="http://www.wayoflife.org/articles/truefalse/truefalse03.htm"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.wayoflife.org/articles/truefalse/truefalse03.htm[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][URL="http://www.wayoflife.org/articles/truefalse/truefalse03.htm"] [/URL][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000000]"God was manifest in the flesh" (1 Tim. 3:16) - T.L. Hubeart Jr.[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][URL="http://www.ecclesia.org/truth/manu******_evidence.html"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.ecclesia.org/truth/manu******_evidence.html[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][URL="http://www.ecclesia.org/truth/manu******_evidence.html"] [/URL][URL="http://www.purewords.org/kjb1611/html/obiblios.htm"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#9136ad]http://www.purewords.org/kjb1611/html/obiblios.htm[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][URL="http://www.purewords.org/kjb1611/html/obiblios.htm"] [/URL][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000000]Manu****** Evidence for Verses Disputed by the Modern Versions[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000000]Good notes from Dean John Burgon[/COLOR][/SIZE] [URL="http://www.mag-net.com/~maranath/OLDBEST.HTM#TIM316"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.mag-net.com/~maranath/OLDBEST.HTM#TIM316[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][URL="http://www.mag-net.com/~maranath/OLDBEST.HTM#TIM316"] [/URL][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000000]The Oldest and Best Manu******s By Cecil J. Carter [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000000]When scholars list Vaticanus as omitting "God", from the text they are sorely tempted not to mention, that Hort's oldest and best Vaticanus, omits ALL of the first and send Timothy, Titus, and Revelation. [/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [CENTER][B][SIZE=4]The Evidence for reading "God was manifest in the flesh". [/SIZE][/B][/CENTER] [LEFT][SIZE=4]All the Uncial copies, (in Burgon's day) except two. [/SIZE] [SIZE=4]The 15,000 times repaired Sinaiticus. [/SIZE] [SIZE=4]And the most depraved of all Mss.-D. [/SIZE] [SIZE=4]All of the cursives except one. [/SIZE] [SIZE=4]And Vaticanus which omits all of 1st and 2nd Timothy, and consequently has nothing to say in this great controversy. [/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][URL="http://www.avbibleversesvindicated.blogspot.com/"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.avbibleversesvindicated.blogspot.com/[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][URL="http://www.avbibleversesvindicated.blogspot.com/"] [/URL][SIZE=4]AV Verses Vindicated. Romans to Revelation[/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][URL="http://www.americanpresbyterianchurch.org/the_johannine_comma.htm"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.americanpresbyterianchurch.org/the_johannine_comma.htm[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][URL="http://www.americanpresbyterianchurch.org/the_johannine_comma.htm"] [/URL][SIZE=4](A bit about the Vulgate issues)[/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]These next two have lots of excellent information, although may need a couple[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]of corrections or adjustments too, the tone is a bit harsh.[/COLOR][/SIZE] [COLOR=#800000][URL="http://www.lamblion.net/Articles/patristic_chart.htm"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.lamblion.net/Articles/patristic_chart.htm[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][/COLOR][URL="http://www.lamblion.net/Articles/patristic_chart.htm"] [/URL][COLOR=#800000][SIZE=4]Scott Jones - Patristic Comparision Chart[/SIZE][/COLOR][/LEFT] [LEFT][COLOR=#800000][URL="http://www.lamblion.net/Articles/ScottJones/false_citations.htm"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#9136ad]http://www.lamblion.net/Articles/ScottJones/false_citations.htm[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][URL="http://www.lamblion.net/Articles/ScottJones/false_citations.htm"] [/URL][SIZE=4]Scott Jones - False Citations in NA/UBS 1 Timothy 3:16 Examined [/SIZE] [/COLOR][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080][B]==================================================================[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE] [B][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]COMMENTARY ON "MYSTERY"[/COLOR][/SIZE][/B][/LEFT] [LEFT][COLOR=#800000][URL="http://www.levendwater.org/analysis/a3/mystery_manifested.htm"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.levendwater.org/analysis/a3/mystery_manifested.htm[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][/COLOR] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]Mystery Manifested (!) By Charles H. Welch[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]The relative pronoun hos should agree with its antecedent, yet musterion is neuter. Bloomfield in his Synoplica says, "hos ephanerothe is not Greek". [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080][B]==================================================================[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE] [B][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]BOOKS[/COLOR][/SIZE][/B][/LEFT] [LEFT][COLOR=#800000][URL="http://vancepublications.com/classic%20reprints.htm"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://vancepublications.com/classic%20reprints.htm[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][/COLOR][URL="http://vancepublications.com/classic%20reprints.htm"] [/URL][COLOR=#800000][SIZE=4]Classic Reprints No. 68[/SIZE][/COLOR] [COLOR=#800000][SIZE=4]A Defense of the Reading 'God Was Manifest in the Flesh' in 1 Timothy 3:16[/SIZE][/COLOR] [COLOR=#800000][SIZE=4]By Ebenezer Henderson and Moses Stuart 1832 80 pages $15.00 [/SIZE][/COLOR] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]Long before Dean Burgon (1813-1888) defended the genuineness of the reading "God Was Manifest in the Flesh" in 1 Timothy 3:16, as it appears in the Authorized Version, these two scholars had already done so in the pages of the Congregational magazine [I]The Biblical Repository[/I].[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]And the Dean Burgon book - Revision Revised[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]This includes Revision Revised - with some editing and weaknesses[/COLOR][/SIZE] [COLOR=#800000][URL="http://www.chrlitworld.com/RecentPubs/unholyhands1.htm"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.chrlitworld.com/RecentPubs/unholyhands1.htm[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][/COLOR][URL="http://www.chrlitworld.com/RecentPubs/unholyhands1.htm"] [/URL][COLOR=#800000][SIZE=4]Unholy Hands on the Bible, Volume 1, [/SIZE][/COLOR] [COLOR=#800000][SIZE=4]An Introduction to Textual Criticism[/SIZE][/COLOR][/LEFT] [LEFT][COLOR=#800000][URL="http://www.deanburgonsociety.org/DeanBurgon/dbs0804.htm"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.deanburgonsociety.org/DeanBurgon/dbs0804.htm[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][URL="http://www.deanburgonsociety.org/DeanBurgon/dbs0804.htm"] [/URL][SIZE=4]Burgon's Warnings on Revision of the Textus Receptus and the King James Bible[/SIZE] [SIZE=4]By Pastor D. A. Waite, Th. D., Ph. D., DBS President[/SIZE] [/COLOR][SIZE=4]..[COLOR=#800000]. Dean Burgon, the master textualist, had some very important WARNINGS in his scholarly book, The Revision Revised. The Dean Burgon Society has reprinted this fine volume in a 640 page hardback beautiful edition. It is available as B.F.T. #611 @ $25.00 +$5.00 S&H. The readers are encouraged to study this book and check out the page references for themselves. [/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Good discussion in the Standish book[/COLOR][/SIZE] [COLOR=#800000][URL="http://www.champs-of-truth.com/reform/STN_MBTU.PDF%A0"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.champs-of-truth.com/reform/STN_MBTU.PDF [/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][SIZE=4]or [/SIZE][/COLOR] [COLOR=#800000][URL="http://www.temcat.com/Liberty/standish/bibletrans/mbtutoc.htm"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.temcat.com/Liberty/standish/bibletrans/mbtutoc.htm[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][/COLOR][COLOR=#800000][URL="http://www.temcat.com/Liberty/standish/bibletrans/mbtutoc.htm"] [/URL][SIZE=4]Modern Bible Translations Unmasked - Russell and Colin Standish (SDA)[/SIZE][/COLOR][/LEFT][COLOR=#800000] [LEFT][URL="http://www.temcat.com/Liberty/standish/bibletrans/mbtu18.htm"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.temcat.com/Liberty/standish/bibletrans/mbtu18.htm[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][URL="http://www.temcat.com/Liberty/standish/bibletrans/mbtu18.htm"] [/URL][SIZE=4]Chapter 18 - A Crucial Text[/SIZE] [SIZE=4]But no English Bible of the Protestant Reformation affronted our Lord in this manner. They translated this passage as follows: [/SIZE] [SIZE=4]God was shewed in the flesche. Tyndale, 1534[/SIZE] [SIZE=4]God was shewed in the flesche. Great Bible, 1539[/SIZE] [SIZE=4]God is shewed in the flesche. Geneva New Testament, 1557[/SIZE] [SIZE=4]God was shewed manifestly in the flesh. Bishop’s Bible, 1568[/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][/LEFT][/COLOR][LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]==================================================================[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080][B]FUTURE WEB PAGE OUTLINE SUGGESTION - WIP [/B][/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]1 Timothy 3:16 - "God was manifest in the flesh"[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]1) Manu****** Evidence (including lectionary)[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]2) Early Church Writer Evidence[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]3) Grammatical Considerations[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]4) Theos Alternative Quandry (the huge difficulties with the various non-Theos alternatives)[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]ALSO[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]5) Doctrinal Considerations [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]6) Objectionist History, unitarian, JW, islamist and others opposed to the Deity of Messiah[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4]===================================================================[/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080][B]WESTCOTT AND HORT MANIPULATIONS[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]We even know the actual history of the attempt to change the Bible.[/COLOR][/SIZE] [URL="http://www.pathlights.com/onlinebooks/downloads/The%20King%20James%20%26%20Modern%20Translations.pdf"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#247cd4]http://www.pathlights.com/onlinebooks/downloads/The%20King%20James%20&%20Modern%20Translations.pdf[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][URL="http://www.pathlights.com/onlinebooks/downloads/The%20King%20James%20%26%20Modern%20Translations.pdf"] [/URL][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000][B]The King James Bible and the Modern Versions by Vance Ferrell [/B][/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][FONT=Times New Roman, Times][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]Smith, Vance (19th century) Pastor of St. Saviour’s Gate Unitarian Church. His participation in the Revision Committee of 1871-1881 evoked bitter controversy, especially with regard to the role he played in removing the word, God, from 1 Timothy 3:16. This apostate worked closely with Westcott and Hort, in controlling the translation of the English Revised Version. p. 37[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]But Westcott declared that he would leave the committee if Smith was forced out. So Smith was kept on the committee. It is for such reasons that, when the English Revised Version was printed in 1881, 1 Timothy 3:16 was changed from "God was manifest in the flesh" to "who was manifest in the flesh." p. 203[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][FONT=Times New Roman, Times][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]1 Timothy 3:16 is a shocking example of what happens when modern translators take two manu******s (the Sinaiticus and Vaticanus)and ignore all the rest. Under the urging of Westcott and Hort, the Revision Committee of 1871-1881 viciously attacked the Deity of Christ in 1 Timothy 3:16. They altered the traditional, "God was manifest in the flesh," to the corrupt, "he who was manifest in the flesh." They had the Sinaiticus and Vaticanus as support for this change. In response to this, Burgon wrote a letter, pleading with the committee’s chairman, Bishop Ellicott, not to permit that to be put in the new Bible.[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][/LEFT] [LEFT][FONT=Times New Roman, Times][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]"[B]Behold then the provision which the Author of ******ure has made for the effectual conservation in its integrity of this portion of His written Word! [/B]Upwards of 1,800 years have run their course since the Holy Ghost, by His servant Paul, rehearsed ‘the Mystery of Godliness,’ declaring this to be the great foundation fact, namely, that ‘God was manifest in the flesh.’ And lo! out of 254 copies of St. Paul’s Epistles, no less than 252 are discovered to have preserved that expression. The copies whereof we speak were procured in every part of Christendom, being derived in every instance from copies older than themselves; which again were tran******s of copies older still. They have since found their way, without design or contrivance, into the libraries of every country in Europe, where they are jealously guarded . . We submit, as a proper and just conclusion from these facts, that men who, in view of the evidence before them, would cast out of the ******ure at this vital point, the word ‘God’ and replace it by ‘he who’ have thereby demonstrated their unfitness for the work of revising the Greek text of the New Testament."Burgon, quoted in Fuller, True or False? p. 98.[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][/LEFT] [LEFT][FONT=Times New Roman, Times][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]"The minority manu******s disagree as much (or more) among themselves as they do with the majority. We are not judging between two text forms, one representing 90% of the manu******s and the other 10%. Rather we have to judge between 90% and a fraction of 1% (comparing the Majority Text with P75 and B text form for example). [B]Or to take a specific case, in 1 Timothy 3:16, over 300 Greek manu******s read ‘God’ [KJV] . . Greek manu******s read ‘who’ [NIV, NASV, etc.] So we have to judge between 97% and 2% [/B]. . - Wilbur Pickering, The Identity of the New Testament Text, pp. 114-120, 25, 149, 150, 237.[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Times New Roman, Times][SIZE=4][B]P.103 in the Vance Farrell book.[/B][/SIZE][/FONT][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4]=====================================================================[/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080][B]Some Bible Versions -- [/B][/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][B][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]TRADITIONAL TEXT[/COLOR][/SIZE][/B][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800080]God was shewed in the flesche. Tyndale, 1534[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800080]God was shewed in the flesche. Great Bible, 1539[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800080]God is shewed in the flesche. Geneva New Testament, 1557[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800080]God was shewed manifestly in the flesh. Bishop’s Bible, 1568[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][COLOR=#800000][SIZE=4][B]"And confessedly [I]the mystery of piety is great[/I]. God has been manifested in flesh[/B], has been justified in the Spirit, has appeared to angels, has been preached among the nations, has been believed on in the world, has been received up in glory." (Darby)[/SIZE][/COLOR][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]"And without controversy, [I]great is the mystery of godliness[/I]: [B]God was manifest in the flesh[/B], justified in the Spirit, seen by angels, preached to the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory." (Webster)[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]"[A]nd, confessedly, [I]great is the secret of piety[/I][B]God was manifested in flesh[/B], declared righteous in spirit, seen by messengers, preached among nations, believed on in the world, taken up in glory!" (Young's Literal Translation)[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]Without controversy, the mystery of godliness is great: God was revealed in the flesh, justified in the spirit, seen by angels, preached among the nations, believed on in the world, and received up in glory.[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000](World English Bible)[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]"And without controversy great [I]is the mystery of godliness[/I]: [B]God was manifested in the flesh[/B], justified in the Spirit, seen by angels, preached among the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up in glory." (NKJ) [/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]====================================================================[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080][B]1 TIMOTHY 3:16 AFFLICTED VERSIONS[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#808000]"Beyond all question, the [I]mystery of godliness is great[/I]: He [B]appeared in a body[/B], was vindicated by the Spirit, was seen by angels, was preached among the nations, was believed on in the world, was taken up in glory." (NIV)[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#808000]"And by common confession gr[I]eat is the mystery of godliness[/I]: [B]He who was revealed in the flesh[/B], was vindicated in the Spirit, beheld by angels, proclaimed among the nations, believed on in the world, taken up in glory." (NAS)[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#808000](RNKJV) And without controversy great is the mystery of reverence: who was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#808000](Diaglott) A pillar and basis of the truth and confessedly great is the of the piety secret. Who was manifested in flesh, was justified in spirit, was seen by messengers, was proclaimed among nations, was believed among a world, was taken up in glory.[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#808000](Weymouth)[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#808000]And, beyond controversy, great is the mystery of our religion-- that Christ appeared in human form, and His claims justified by the Spirit, was seen by angels and proclaimed among Gentile nations, was believed on in the world, and received up again into glory.[/COLOR][COLOR=#808000] WEY[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#808000]American Standard Version (with typical footnote)[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#808000]And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness; He who was manifested in the flesh, Justified in the spirit, Seen of angels, Preached among the nations, Believed on in the world, Received up in glory[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#808000]"The word God, in place of He who, rest on no sufficient ancient evidence. Some ancient authorities read which."[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#808000](NetBible) And we all agree, our religion contains amazing revelation:He was revealed in the flesh,vindicated by the Spirit,seen by angels,proclaimed among Gentiles,believed on in the world,taken up in glory. (combined with the usual Daniel Wallace footnote convoluted stuff)[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080][B]======================================================================[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE] [B][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]GREEK [/COLOR][/SIZE][/B][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]1st Timothy 3:16[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]kai omologoumenws mega estin to ths eusebeias musthrion os efanerwqh en sarki edikaiwthh en pneumati wfthh aggelois ekhrucqh en ethnesin episteuthh en kosmw anelhmfthh en doxh[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000](Westcott-Hort text from 1881).[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]1st Timothy 3:16 [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]kai omologoumenws mega estin to ths eusebeias musthrion theos efanerwqh en sarki edikaiwthh en pneumati wfthh aggelois ekhrucqh en ethnesin episteuthh en kosmw anelhfthh en doxh [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000](Stephens 1550 Textus Receptus).[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#800000]==========================================================================[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Shalom,[/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]Schmuel[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT] [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000080]This post archived at [/COLOR][/SIZE] [COLOR=#000080][URL="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/9925"][SIZE=4][COLOR=#9136ad]http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/message/9925[/COLOR][/SIZE][/URL][/COLOR][/LEFT][/COLOR][LEFT][/LEFT] [/QUOTE]

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